On 3 June 2016 at 17:10, Rafael Espíndola rafael.espindola@gmail.com wrote:
Do keep in mind you are comparing a 11 year old project and a 11 month old one. There is a lot more churn on the 11 month old one.
LLD is at least 5 years old. Every time you re-write it doesn't reset history.
Again, I am truly sorry we were unable to come up with a perfect design the first time. For the record, I don't think it is perfect yet. There will likely be more big changes to lld. That is the cost of trying to build as good a linker as we can.
This is not about what you do. It's about *how* you do it.
We have developers trying to create a linker. They are working on LLD because Chris wanted a true LLVM linker. But it seems that you want a project that you can do whatever you want, whenever you want.
This is *NOT* open source. Right now, LLD is *nothing more* than Rui's and Rafael's pet project. I cannot recommend Linaro to collaborate on those terms, and I sincerely recommend anyone that is listening to this thread to not do so either.
Being open source doesn't mean I get to implement what someone else wants. You are more than welcome to send patches, but they have avoid harming the rest of the linker. In particular, at this early stage they cannot harm its development. Once we have a mature project we can actually evaluate tradeoff.
We're clearly not welcome to send patches. We did, and you re-wrote it and committed without asking the original author.
So, the plan is to wait for you to finish the initial implementation alone? Again? What do we do in the interim? How many times are we going to go through this?
I have waited 2 years before LLD was barely useful, then Adhemerval implemented the AArch64 back-end. Then you destroyed and now we have waited another year, but we're still unable to collaborate. If anything, now it's even harder than it was last year.
Why can't we help with the design, too? We know about ARM and AArch64, that's what we do, and we can provide you with the expertise without having to go on your own doing everything. That is the whole point of collaborative development, and it seems that you're missing this point.
And just like we did, you are more than welcome to try to write something better. Please let us know how it goes.
Is this the position of every LLD developer?
Rui, Nick, Chris?
I'm seriously looking for others to chime in and let me know if that is the final stance on LLD, so that I can finally write it off and go work on another linker.
If the official position is that LLD is a project that only Rui and Rafael can design and implement for another 2~3 years, I *cannot* recommend Linaro and its members to participate.
cheers, --renato